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04 Jul 2010

Cowboy Mike Sneak XXV Preview!

Chapters, Cobra Crack, cowboy mike, Michael Jackson, previews, Sabah 126 Comments

Sabah hung up the phone with a deep, gut wrenching sigh.

"Is everything okay, Ms. Graham?"  It was the young purposeful security guard who had been assigned to her when she was kept prisoner at the hideout.  He was smiling at her and holding the car door open, the car Michael sent for her.   What was his name again?

"Hi, Colin,"  Sabah answered dejectedly when his name flashed in her mind.   His smile widened as he pulled the car door open wider  and all of a sudden Sabah felt awful.  She remembered how rude she'd been to him when he was just doing his job, how she made him follow her for a half an hour in the grocery store for no reason and how she snapped at him when he tried to prevent her from buying those tabloid magazines.  He was right to want her not to see them.  They were awful magazines and she was an awful person.  She just couldn't shake the feeling of being bad these days.   The quest for a nurse to watch her mother was going awful.   On every interview she just knew that the women were thinking, why is she hiring me when she is an able bodied, young woman?   She looked in their eyes and saw what they were thinking.  She was selfish, selfish, SELFISH.

Looking up, her big eyes were shiny with unshed tears, Sabah spoke in a low voice.   "I want to tell you I'm so sorry for how I acted towards you when . . . "  Her voice trailed away when a big tear crested over her lower eye lids and slid down her cheek.  Colin looked at her in confusion.

"What?"  It was hard to concentrate on what she was saying when he couldn't get over how gorgeous she was.  Those weeks he worked with her, he had managed to hide it by being ultra-professional and serious.  But it had been a while since he'd seen her and he'd d forgotten how breath-taking she was.  "Oh, that's okay, Ms. Graham, it's understandable, with what was happening."  He tried to comfort her.

"No, no, it's no excuse."  Sabah rummaged through her hand bag and tried to pull out a tissue.  Her tears were falling unchecked now.

"Ms. Graham, are you okay?"

"No, I - I - I aammmmmm o-o-kay."   But she couldn't get the words out because she was crying  harder and harder.

Colin shut the door and put his hand lightly on her shoulder and then took it off.  "Do you want me to get someone, something?"

He was blocking the view of the driver who sat impatiently wondering what was taking so long for Colin to get Ms. Graham into the car.  Sabah looked up at Colin who stood a couple of inches taller than her, and just a few inches away.  She was so pretty, Colin thought to himself.  He never realized how pretty she was.  Her sadness reached out to him and before he realized what he was doing,

"What in the world!"  Sabah snapped out of her sadness as she felt Colin's lips touch hers.  It took her a half a second to push him away at the same time as she stepped back.   It was the last thing she was expecting.  One minute he was asking her if he could get something for her and the next minute she felt his lips on hers.   How did she let that happen!!!   A feeling of mortification came over her as she wondered how she was going to explain this to Michael!  She had to tell him and he was going to blame her, she knew it.

"I'm so sorry, Ms. Graham."  Colin's face was flushed and he was speaking fast.  "I don't know what came over me."

Sabah wrenched the car door open and stepped inside.  "It's okay.   Let's just forget it."  Oh, my God, did the driver see?  She didn't dare knock on the partition of the limo to find out.  Colin waited uncomfortably outside of the open car door.

"I'm so sorry,"  he repeated.  His mind raced with the possible repercussions of his actions.  One thing was certain, if Mr. Jackson found out about this, he was going to be fired for sure.  "You're not going to say anything -- "

Sabah swung her head around to glare at him.

"I mean, I won't say anything if you won't say anything.  It was a mistake.  I swear.  It's just that you were crying, and you're so beautiful."  For a moment his voice was wistful.

Sabah eyes him suspiciously.  Did he have a crush on her?  How in the world did she miss that?  When he worked with her before he was always so serious.

" I don't know what I was thinking."  Colin blushed and Sabah's heart melted a little.   " Just please close the door so I can think."  She said quietly.  And when he didn't move.  "Please."

He did as she asked but as the car rolled forward, her heart thundered in her ears.  She looked down at the heavy ring on her finger.  Michael was going to kill her!

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126 Responses to “Cowboy Mike Sneak XXV Preview!”

  1. Sabine says:

    :cheerful: LOL, I think this is true!

    I think Michael and Sabah are both young – emotionally – even though they are late twenties, nearly 30!

    Yep, like little babies.

    Sabah seemed to be inviting him! Although that was just his perception – she was obviously staring at him as she was trying to remember his name and then she appeared to be opening up to him, with her tears!!!

    :wassat: :tongue:

    Don't let Sabah hear you say that!!!!

  2. DeborahGreene says:

    omg this site just described me perfectly, i read another story somewhere else and got hooked and couldnt sleep and all that jazz, wow this is nuts i love it

  3. Sabine says:

    Hmmm, welcome, Deborah and don't worry, in a minute you won't even be thinking about that other story :cheerful:

  4. Bella says:

    ok, to be honest, yes I want Sabbah to have an affair with Colin...but only if she doesn't go on tour with mj (which I personally prefer)...and then to realize that she's actually confused and it's michael who she really loves...but I also want mj to somehow find out about it ...i don't know...i just want something spicy...like really spicy...

  5. Mika says:

    WTF Bella why would you want tht ever that too me is not spicy it's sickening and if it did happen I'd just :sick: then :cwy: they're soulmates once you have your soulmates u don't want anyone else and tht would be the ultimate betrayal like after all this stuff I told u and shared with ur just gonna cheat on me to thts just unnesary drama tht makes no sense and tht would make me stop reading but ME WANT CHAPTER plz :angel:

  6. CherryLeigh says:

    Girls, relax! I think if a small "kiss" like this could still threaten Sabah and Michael's relationship, then the whole year they've been together, opening up to each other about their fears and dreams really didn't mean a lot. I think Sabah could never go from MICHAEL to Colin, that would be unrealistic right now and out of character. On the other hand, she can't influence Colin's feelings for her, she can ignore him but if he was genuinly in love with her this might urge him on even more...so it would be fun to see how Colin and Michael handle the situation but I think Sabah is the one who could cause the least harm right now.

  7. Bella says:

    :blink: WOW Mika, are you okay? :chill out...it was just a thought I wanted to share with Sabine!!! That doesn't need to happen...
    :unsure: sickening? gee people...

  8. ladake says:

    I agree CherryLeigh!

    But dammit if this story ain't stirring up some emotions. Folks are invested! :lol:

    And like you said, it would be very unrealistic and totally out of character for Sabah to even think about Colin that way, especially since she knows and has experienced betrayal in her previous relationship. Plus she's constantly said throughout her relationship with Michael how she is not a cheater and that just isn't something that she would do. So I have no reason to doubt her. And Mike's behind betta have just as much faith.

    Meanwhile, I'm extremely curious to see how Sabine writes this whole thing out. I'm giddy over here with anticipation!!

    :silly:

  9. Sabine says:

    ha, ha, I love all the anticipation. I read Bella just wanting some Twilight action in the story :tongue:

    However, I don't think Sabah is as wishy-washy as young I-don't-know-who-I-love Bella (Twilight's Bella, not our Bella who is commenting). :cheerful:

    I am writing away as we speak so you guys just have to wait a little while longer!!!! :kissing:

  10. Mika says:

    Sorry like I didn't mean it like the way it came out sorry to offend like I wasn't really being serious sorry :unsure:

  11. ladake says:

    It's alright Sabine. I'll be patient.

    It's killing me softly, but I'll be patient. :biggrin:

  12. Fluffpudel says:

    aaaaoooiii :ninja:

  13. Colette says:

    I hope there is none of that Twilight/OC teenage crap, jumming from lover to lover and then back again, I love Sabah and Michael together, and that's the way it should stay,I don't want any of the spicy stuff Bella is talking about :lol:

  14. Colette says:

    jumming is not a work lol, I meant jumping :tongue:

  15. Sabine says:

    jumming is not a work lol

    Looks like you're either jonesing real bad for another chapter or you took a bad hit from another supplier LOL!!!!

    I've been so very vocal about Twilight and Bella -- I think she's like the worst role model for young girls that I've ever seen, but you know it's not just teens that are into her. I saw a lot of grown women swooning over the whole I can't-live-w/o-him;without-anyone-so-let-me-use-my-friend - that whole I don't know who I love, first I want you than I want him (but I really just don't want to be alone) thing and I was like

    :w00t:

    Yeah, drama is exciting (Romeo & Juliet is all about drama -- so are most great love stories -- but I just don't see the "love" in Twilight.

    I see lots of co-dependent dysfunctionalism though :tongue:

    For instance, the scene where Bella cudddles up with Jake in the tent while Edward fumes just a few feet away -- hmmm, I should write something like that!

    :cheerful: :silly:

    Uh, not :pouty:

  16. Jenny says:

    I am glad I've never been to see Twilight - it sounds horrendous :dizzy:

    Now if Cowboy Mike was a film - I'd be there, on my own, every afternoon (whilst the kids are at school). Can you imagine it?

    Who would play twenty-something Mike? Who would you like to see as Sabah?

  17. ladake says:

    Jenny: I am glad I’ve never been to see Twilight – it sounds horrendous
    Now if Cowboy Mike was a film – I’d be there,on my own, every afternoon (whilst the kids are at school).Can you imagine it?Who would play twenty-something Mike?Who would you like to see as Sabah?

    Oh god, girl, don't even joke. lol

    They'd probably see me coming and pretend the theater was closed, thinking 'damn, not this chic again!'

    Who could play Mike... today?? I seriously can't think of anyone worthy enough and definitely no one that's famous who looks like him. Unless there's some unknown man out there.

    I've already submitted ideas on who I think Sabah looks like to me.

  18. Bella says:

    :shocked: How you guys jumped to Twilight and OC, I have no idea...On one hand, I haven't watched the Twilight movie and second I don't think an affair with Colin would make Sabbah as you said Sabine referring to the character from Twilight...When I said I wanted something spicy as an affair with Colin, I didn't mean it just like that...i meant it in the context of michael going on tour without sabbah, him kissing tatiana and stuff, so sabbah feeling hurt and confused finds comfort in colin's arms so to say...it was just something that i envisioned, that doesn't mean i don't want sabbah to be happy with michael...

    You know, this kind of makes me understand Michael more and more, like how he complained that people interpreted what he said in a million different ways than what he actually meant and put it in different contexts...and those million ways would of course be the worst ways...

  19. Jenny says:

    I think you're right ladake - a couple of unknown actors could work best for this film! So long as they had the right chemistry :wub: :silly: :heart: :blush: !!! I think if the actor was trying too hard to me Michael it would fail miserably - who could ever come close? :unsure:

  20. ladake says:

    :lol: :lol:

    Not to mention the film would have to be rated NC-17!!!!!

    :tongue: It just wouldn't be Cowboy Mike if they had to cut some scenes out. It'd have to be a trilogy though. 2 and a half hours just wouldn't be enough!!!

    :biggrin:

  21. Jenny says:

    Maybe they could include all the extras :blush: on a Special Edition DVD!

  22. Sabine says:

    Bella: so sabbah feeling hurt and confused finds comfort in colin’s arms so to say…it was just something that i envisioned, that doesn’t mean i don’t want sabbah to be happy with michael

    Bella, there's no reason to take what other people have said so personally we're all just expressing ourselves, as you did. Not everyone is going to see things the same because we're all different and that's good. Imagine how boring life would be if we all thought the same?

    and how would be learn from each other? If you feel misunderstood, just try to explain. THEN if you find that people reject your explanation or try to tell you what you are thinking, you can compare it to what was done to Michael.

    IMO, going to another person and trying to use them to comfort you because you feel neglected or hurt is dysfunctional and immature -- it's what Bella did in Twilight and I mention it because that series is so popular now. YOu called it "spicy" and I myself don't think it is but maybe other people agree with you -- as a matter of fact I'm sure lots of people agree with you.

    Oh, and Tatiana kissed Michael -- Michael didn't kiss her -- just like Colin kissed Sabah and not the other way around -- I think that's important.

  23. Sabine says:

    Jenny Ladake, a Cowboy Mike movie Ha! You might get one or two lovescenes and nothing as close to as graphic as the what you're reading here!

    But hey they always change the book when they make it into a movie, right?

    I think a person who can play Michael is just someone who captures his spirit -- the person doesn' t even have necessarily look like he did, because I've seen great actors who have channelled another person so perfectly, they BECOME the person.

    As for Sabah, I think again, a great actress who gets the character -- really understands her, could do great.

    It would actually be exciting to see the characters come to life :cheerful:

  24. CherryLeigh says:

    That's definitely important, who kissed who? I was just going to comment on that. Tatina kissed Michael! But then he dealt with her in a very ungentlemanly manner although quite typical for him! But that's another story...

    God, Sabine, I can't WAIT anymore! :w00t: Please, can't you just post the damn thing already?! :wink:
    After all the speculation, we have to know what's REALLY going to happen!

    :heart:

  25. Neicy says:

    I feel like cryin right now!!! ( havent had any addiction nourishment in a while). I feel so sick. *runs out the room*

  26. Sabine says:

    Cherry: Tatina kissed Michael! But then he dealt with her in a very ungentlemanly manner although quite typical for him! But that’s another story…

    What ungentlemanly manner are you talking about?

    As far as I know Michael has always been a gentleman so I'm waiting to hear why you say "quite typical for him".

    Girl, are we talking about the same Michael?

    Tatiana is quite delusional -- she still talks about that kiss that happened over 20 years ago like it was yesterday, and in her mind she had a relationships with Michael when nothing could be further from the truth.

    Cherry: God, Sabine, I can’t WAIT anymore! :w00t: Please, can’t you just post the damn thing already?! :wink:
    After all the speculation, we have to know what’s REALLY going to happen!

    Now, now remember all good things come to those who wait! :tongue:

  27. Sabine says:

    I'm sorry but I'm wriiiiiiiitttttttttinggggggg, I swear

    :kissing:

  28. ladake says:

    Awww, Sabine, I know you're writing and I really do appreciate it. I enjoy this story sooooo much.

    But girl, you named the cite. You should know! You're like our pusher man.

    We're all just feenin' right now, going through withdrawals and whatnot.

  29. Sabine says:

    Girl, you know I love it!!!!!

  30. Jenny says:

    You should be charging us for each fix! We are such a bunch of Mikaholics - and Sabaholics for that matter lol

    :w00t: :w00t: :w00t:

  31. Sabine says:

    Sabaholics :lol: I like that!

  32. CherryLeigh says:

    Okay, don't devour me, I'm going to explain. :silly:

    First of all, I didn't mean to say that Michael wasn't a gentleman, he was very much so.
    But I think how Tatiana was dealt with after the kiss was pretty mean and ungentlemanly.

    I'm torn about Tatianan's version of the story but it's the only version we have and while
    I agree that she was quite delusional, I believe that it was the way she writes, there was something
    between Michael and her. To her it was probably more than to him but even Katherine said in an interview
    I heard that Michael had told her that he liked Tatiana very much.

    According to Tatiana, Michael agreed to do to the kiss onstage and from the pictures that we have
    of it, he seems to enjoy himself a lot. :wink: And it was just a kiss, after all, part of a show, everybody had seen the video and the sizzling chemistry between Mike and Tatiana there so why was it such a big deal? I really never understood that. But apparently it was such a big deal that afterwards, Tatiana was unceremoniously thrown out of the show. And this is where I think Michael should have acted different from the way he did. From what I know, Tatiana was fired and never got to speak with Michael about the whole thing again. Couldn't he at least have called her and tell her "I'm sorry how this was handled", you know, comfort her a little, try to make her understand why his management fired her and so on. No, he enjoyed the kiss but let Tatiana take the blame for it and then according to her didn't speak to her again. You just don't do this, imo! Yes, his management controled everything and firing Tatiana was business for them but Michael should have called Tatiana or met her to speak to her about this on a personal level, just, as I said, tell her he's sorry, he can't do anything, just explain things to her.

    This is where the "typical for him" comes in. We know he didn't like to face people if a situation turned ugly or uncomfortable so he just let other people deal with it. Maybe he also was afraid that Tatiana would throw herself at him and he didn't know how to handle that because of his shyness and so on.
    That's why I say what he should have done but why he did not do it due to the way he was. He didn't like those kind of confrontations, who does? But I think this time he should have been more mature and just speak to the girl and explain things. That's what I would have wanted so I understand Tatiana when she says that this really hurt her the most, the way he behaved, not his management.

    At the Grammys they saw each other again because she performed with him but her appearance is a joke imo and he pretty much ignores her. She said that backstage Michael had told everybody he didn't want her to speak to him so people should try to keep her from him but she found him anyway and when she did, he acted as if nothing had happened and that he had tried to reach her but was told she was in Europe. This is what Tatiana wrote in her book I think. I don't know if she tells the truth but we know for a fact that they were together at the Grammys and that she was on stage with him for like 2 seconds and he pretty much ignored her and that was it.

    To sum it up, Michael behaved like we knew Michael would because of his issues, that's why I said typical but still that doesn't mean that he shouldn't have made an effort to explain things to her to, you know, just for once behave like a grown, mature man and to the right thing instead of letting the girl take all the blame and hide behide his managment. So while I don't necessarily like Tatiana very much, I understand her pain and disappoinment.

  33. Colette says:

    :lol: Sabine I'm really anxious for a new chapter, and I meant "word" not "work" jeez I can barely string a sentence together, I need a new chapter ASAP and I have to admit, I've been to that site your were telling us about, the one that is a ripofff of yours, it was alittle strange, you could tell that the person is copying everything your doing, it's not the same, I had to leave immediately :lol:

  34. Colette says:

    I really feel forTatania, I would be just as hurt as she is, she never got any closure. The kiss between them was not one sided, and Michael was into the kiss, he had his hand on her bum. There was definitely chemistry between them. I think Michael was afraid to fall in love because he didn't want to be distracted from his career, and he felt a woman would be in the way trying to control him, and she would be too much of a distraction. You know what I would have been so happy if they had ended up together, she's a million times better than Presley or Debbie, they are shit. :getlost:

  35. CherryLeigh says:

    Yeah, I think if we just put ourselves in her shoes for a minute we can understand why she was so upset and never really got over the whole affair. Hearing from various people that Michael liked her/was interested in her, then kissing him and feeling that he's totally into it, too, only to be thrown out of the show without any explanation what so ever from Michael...that's tough. I mean, if he had really cared for her, he could have done something about the situation, I believe that 100%. His management controled a lot but he could have seen her privately and talk to her about it. And if he didn't care for her after all, okay, fine, but you can still be decent and fair and talk to the other person at least for one last time to explain and to say sorry.

  36. Sabine says:

    Cherry: Couldn’t he at least have called her and tell her “I’m sorry how this was handled”, you know, comfort her a little, try to make her understand why his management fired her and so on. No, he enjoyed the kiss but let Tatiana take the blame for it and then according to her didn’t speak to her again.

    Well, let me give you a different perspective on the whole situation. I hear both of you guys, Colette and Cherry, but let me tell you how I see it -- and this is based in part from my own experience with people and from things I've heard/know about Michael.

    No. 1, I think it's assuming to think Michael enjoyed the kiss. He never said he did and his actions speak louder than words. He fired her.

    No. 2, When people don't have respect for your boundaries, it's hard to get them to understand how you feel. It's like trying to give closure to someone who is stalking you or harassing you. They don't get it; they don't respect your feelings because they are only interested in getting what they want.

    So basically there's no nice way to explain to a person who doesn't give a fuck how you feel why you have to get them the hell away from you.

    You can't give closure to a person who has disrespected your boundaries. The sad truth is the only way to make them respect your boundaries is with toughness and finality.

    I believe Tatiana had delusions from the very beginning. She was a young girl trying to make it and Michael was her big break. She got it into her head that Michael liked her right off, and like Michael said, he has to be attracted to a girl to make the scenes in his videos believable, so yes, he found Tatiana attractive -- but finding someone attractive doesn't mean that he wants to be with them.

    Michael is super nice and a flirt -- so Tatiana let this go to her head and convinced herself it was more than what it was.

    Cherry: it was just a kiss, after all, part of a show, everybody had seen the video and the sizzling chemistry between Mike and Tatiana there so why was it such a big deal? I really never understood that.

    Okay, since it's confusing to you, now ask yourself what makes sense?

    That Michael and Tatiana both agreed to the on stage kiss and she did it and then for some strange reason she was unceremoniously fired without one word

    :ermm: orrrrrrrrrrrrr

    Michael did not agree to the onstage kiss; Tatiana took advantage of the situation, acted in an unprofessional manner, made Michael feel super uncomfortable that she was trying to force something on him that he didn't feel, so that even though Michael being the consummate performer that he was went with it for the sake of a good show he made sure afterward to promptly tell Frank to get rid of her?

    Not knowing anything else, what makes sense?

    Karen said that Tatiana was making Michael very uncomfortable. She said she'd listen to his songs over and over and over again on her walkman and once confessed to her that she felt Michael had written the song FOR HER. Now I don't believe everything that Karen says 'cause I think she's crazy too, but with everything that happened, her description of Tatiana makes sense.

    Her description of Tatiana also fits what Tatitana described in her own words -- in her book, she took very simple interactions and described them like they were the beginning of a love affair.

    Twenty years later she is still talking about how Michael brushed the dust off of her butt like he was dying to touch her. She told herself that Michael was into the kiss -- um it's called acting.

    As for Katherine, I think Katherine was trying to save Michael from the rumors that were starting with the child abuse allegations -- the truth is, she didn't know what was going on in Michael's love life. He didn't tell her. He told us that in the Schmuley tapes -- how he didn't talk to his mother about "mushy stuff".

    What makes sense is if Michael was into the kiss he would have been with her, there was nothing stopping him from doing so.
    . . .. or was there?

    Personally I believe Michael also behaved that way with her because he was already in a relationship -- that's why he didn't want to talk to her; that's why he acted like it never happened and he bullshited her about why he didn't contact her; that's why he had her fired immediately and that's why he didn't want to be with her. :wink:

    Again, Tatiana's version of the story is that Michael told everyone BUT HER that he liked her very much?

    Does that make sense?

    Even w/ Michael being super shy, does it make sense that he would send messages to her through other people and then fire her when she kissed him?

    Or does it make sense that he never said anything such thing, that he didn't like her at all like that and that's why she got fired when he kissed her?

    I don't think anyone can draw conclusions from a few pictures -- Michael was a performer. Of course the pics look good.

  37. Sabine says:

    Colette: Sabine I’m really anxious for a new chapter, and I meant “word” not “work” jeez I can barely string a sentence together, I need a new chapter ASAP and I have to admit, I’ve been to that site your were telling us about, the one that is a ripofff of yours, it was alittle strange, you could tell that the person is copying everything your doing, it’s not the same, I had to leave immediately

    Fraternizing with the enemy AND asking for a new chapter?

    Ha!

    :lol: Honestly, it's supposed to be flattering when someone copies off of you, but that person is just plain evil. She has stalked and harassed me, insulted me, slandered me and all the while has been copying off of me like crazy -- I don't waste a lot of time thinking about her or her carbon copy sub-par site -- It's best to ignore it and not even worth my attention, but admittedly like a fly, sometimes it gets incredibly annoying.

    But , at the end of the day I take extreme comfort in knowing, those who can do and those who can't copy. :whistle:

  38. CherryLeigh says:

    Yes, you do have a point Sabine, I admit that. :) But I think Michael wasn't in a relationship with somebody else and I think he enjoyed that kiss. If it wasn't planned and had taken him by surprise then I think those photos would have looked a lot different...to me it looks as if both of them heavily flirted and then kissed and Michael doesn't look neither surprised nor uncomfortable. Sure, that could have been acted but we don't know that.

    So you say Michael didn't speak to her afterwards because she crossed the boundary by kissing him? Hmm...maybe but that as a reaction to this kiss seems a little exaggerated to me but I'm not Michael and I wasn't there so...

    Anyway it's good to speak about things, present our points and hear that from others.

    I was going with what I had heard from Tatiana, trying to understand her POV and not only Michael's because imo he is so often seen as the victim in every situation but I just sometimes wonder how it must have been for the other side, as well.

    I think we can drop this now. :smile:

  39. Sabine says:

    Cherry: Yes, you do have a point Sabine, I admit that. :) But I think Michael wasn’t in a relationship with somebody else and I think he enjoyed that kiss. If it wasn’t planned and had taken him by surprise then I think those photos would have looked a lot different…to me it looks as if both of them heavily flirted and then kissed and Michael doesn’t look neither surprised nor uncomfortable. Sure, that could have been acted but we don’t know that.

    yeah, but what is it all based on? Wishful thinking? :kissing:

    I can give you thousand of stills from a movie that look believable and it means nothing. Michael was a performer.

    Cherry: So you say Michael didn’t speak to her afterwards because she crossed the boundary by kissing him? Hmm…maybe but that as a reaction to this kiss seems a little exaggerated to me but I’m not Michael and I wasn’t there so…

    If someone kisses you while you're in a relationship with someone else, think of it that way, that reaction is not exaggerated at all. Especially if they think you have a stalker personality. Remember Mike had been stalked a lot in his life. I can fully see him not wanting to encourage any of that.

    Cherry: I was going with what I had heard from Tatiana, trying to understand her POV and not only Michael’s because imo he is so often seen as the victim in every situation but I just sometimes wonder how it must have been for the other side, as well.

    Michael really never gave his POV on the whole thing, which I think speaks volumes. Whereas Tatiana is STILL talking about this, even thought it's decades later, which I think also speaks volumes.

    And girl, Michael WAS victimized a lot in his life. No one can deny that. It wasn't just something he "presented" that way. That's what happens when you're so successful and so covetted everyone wants a piece of you.

    Cherry: I think we can drop this now.

    :lol: :lol: Is that your way of telling me to shut up?

    That's how I always take that comment. I gotta say this: One of the rules of healthy debating/communicating -- both people talk and talk until they feel heard.

    One person saying "I think we can drop this now" is kind of like telling the other person to shut up! Another version of this is "I think we can agree to disagree".

    It's more functional to ask the other person if they feel heard and/or communicate that you've heard them and ask if they have anything else they'd like to say if the person wants to move on from the subject -- that or just don't reply :smile: .

  40. CherryLeigh says:

    Gee, noooo, I didn't mean to tell you to shut up! But it's kind of exhausting for me to talk about something that can always be turned around no matter what you say. I mean, I think this and you think that and we will always find something to "prove" the other wrong because both of us and probably all the girls here have thought about Tatiana and all the other Michael mysteries a very long time and have come up with our own version of them which are sometimes based on our own experiences and so on. Neither of us knows what really happened so I think now that I have said what I think and you have answered me, it's ok, there's nothing further to debate. I hope you heard me, I heard you and I agree with you on some points but differ on others but as far as I'm concerned we don't have to discuss them anymore. :smile:

  41. Sabine says:

    Cherry: Gee, noooo, I didn’t mean to tell you to shut up! But it’s kind of exhausting for me to talk about something that can always be turned around no matter what you say.

    :smile: yeah, that's why I said it's okay to just not reply or say something like I don't know -- no one will ever know, which is as close to the truth as we'll ever come.

    Debating a point means countering each idea with another -- I like to do it, because it helps me see other points of view and I think makes me a better thinker. I'm not personally attached to my thoughts -- I can think believe one thing today and change me mind tomorrow.

    To me, it's all just ideas. Like a story :smile:

  42. CherryLeigh says:

    Well to just not reply is kind of rude I think so I always reply and when I don't have anything further to say I say let's drop this, just meaning to me the discussion is finished as far as I'm concerned. . :smile:

    Exactly, it's all just speculation, ideas, thoughts...it's not written in stone and when I see somebody make a valid point I acknowledge it like I just did.

  43. Sabine says:

    just meaning to me the discussion is finished as far as I’m concerned. . :smile:

    Far be it from me to try to continue a discussion that the other person has determined is finished but . . . . do you see how it comes across?

    If you tell the other person you're finished with the conversation, it's sort of rude for them to keep talking about it -- even if they have anything else they want to say, they're compelled to shut up, which is why I think it's kind of rude of say it in the first place.

    But moving on :cheerful: . . . .

    if we didn't speculate and toss around ideas and opinions human beings would have nothing to talk about :lol:

  44. CherryLeigh says:

    Okay, I won't say it again but just not replying to a person's comment anymore is also rude imo because then it seems as if the other person hasn't read the comment or doesn't deem it worthy of note and another reply...
    I think at some point you have to let the other person know that you don't have anything left to say. If the other one still has something to get off their chest they should feel free to write it down but then they know not to expect an answer.

  45. Sabine says:

    Cherry: Okay, I won’t say it again but

    :silly:

    Cherry: just not replying to a person’s comment anymore is also rude imo because then it seems as if the other person hasn’t read the comment or doesn’t deem it worthy of note and another reply…I think at some point you have to let the other person know that you don’t have anything left to say. If the other one still has something to get off their chest they should feel free to write it down but then they know not to expect an answer

    I actually don't agree. I think people do that for a whole 'nother reason, but I won't tell you why I think people do that unless you want to know. I actually think there's a better way to communicate. :wink: :wink:

  46. CherryLeigh says:

    Sabine: I actually thinkthere’s a better way to communicate it

    You know, English isn't my first language so sometimes I might not say things the right way, the way I mean them. I really try be polite and find a way to let the other one know that I heard them but that I don't feel like saying any more. So please tell me, what is a better way? But not replying or saying Oh, I don't know doesn't count. :tongue: :smile:

    Sabine: I actually don’t agree.I think people do that for a whole ‘nother reason, but I won’t tell you why I think people do that unless you want to know.

    Sure! :smile:

    Okay, I hope this time it worked. ^^

  47. CherryLeigh says:

    Okay, it didn't LOL. GOd, why is this so difficult. *whines*

    One more time

    I actually don’t agree.I think people do that for a whole ‘nother reason, but I won’t tell you why I think people do that unless you want to know.I actually thinkthere’s a better way to communicate.

    See above :smile:

  48. Sabine says:

    Oh, I didn't know English wasn't your first language -- thanks for telling me that.

    Well personally I think the better way of communicating is doing something called -- :lol: God, I can't remember the name now, but it's when you just repeat back to the person what they've said.

    When you do that, the other person feels heard and validated, even if you disagree with them. If you have nothing more to say on the subject, like let's take this conversation, and I say, I think Michael was the coolest person on Earth and Tatianna is a stalker. (and you still disagree)

    You can simply say: You think Michael's the coolest person on Earth and Tatiana's a stalker, I hear you. But I still gotta disagree.

    There's no need to say I don't have anything more to say on the subject. You can just keep repeating that, until the person gets that you don't have anything else to say and either changes the subject or moves on.

    It all happens quite naturally.

    :lol: Yay, your quote worked!!!!!

  49. Sabine says:

    It's working, do you see it?

    Just keep doing that! :lol:

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